Mercedes Actros MP2 Measurement Data

Hello forum,
ich hoffe Ihr könnt mir helfen.
'I've been working on a project to collect and record driving data from Mercedes Actros MP2 vehicles for some time now. However, I'm stuck and hope you can help me. Here's my situation:

Vehicles:
- Mercedes Actros MP2 (manufactured in 2004)
- Mercedes Actros MP2 (manufactured in 2005)

Interfaces:
- ELM 327 USB

Values to be collected:
- RPM, speed, mileage, possibly gear and fuel consumption (calculate?).

After spending several weeks intensively studying vehicle diagnostics, CAN bus, etc., I'm still not making progress.
I connected the interface to the OBD connector of the 2005 Actros, and during the automatic scan, CAN/29Bit/250kbaud was detected. Querying diagnostic codes (e.g., RPM 0C) returned usable values that I only needed to convert. For me, this means that the 2005 model uses a standard CAN format and supports diagnostics without additional protocols!

Another attempt with the 2004 model (yes, I thought they were identical ) unfortunately turned out completely differently. Diagnostic interface connected, no return values, or the ELM interface doesn't even detect the correct protocol. My attempts to manually set the protocol (bit rate, ID length, etc.) had no visible effect. Only with certain settings did I see broadcast messages, but they were marked as RX errors.

My second attempt involved using the K-line. The bus initialization was okay, and querying diagnostic codes also worked, but the return values were always the same and therefore unusable.

My third attempt was in desperation, trying to tap into the in-cabin CAN bus that connects to the radio. After manually setting it to CAN/11bit/125kbaud, I received error-free broadcast messages. However, they weren't in either ISO or J1939 format. After researching online, I found out that Mercedes uses 'KWP2000 over CAN' on the in-cabin bus. The ELM can't handle that; I could only display the raw data through monitoring.

Here's a 4-line dump; the first 4 bytes are the header, and the remaining 8 are the message:

10 20 D8 40 00 00 FF FF FF FF FF 0F
0C 20 E4 30 00
00 66 04 F4 06 60 46
0C 20 10 30 01 00 FF 00 F0 FF FF FF
0C 20 EC 30 00 00 FF 0F 03 00 F3 FF
10 20 E4 40 00 04 22 FF FF FF 42 39


And that's when the confusion became complete, and I have the following questions:
- How can it be that two seemingly identical vehicles have such different diagnostic systems?
- How do I get the data from the 2004 model? And why does everything work smoothly on the 2005 model?
- I've read about a COTEL interface from Mercedes that outputs data in J1939 format. Could it be that this is integrated into the 2005 model? Why would this interface then output data through the OBD interface?
- I don't understand why the K-line doesn't return any sensible data. Any ideas?
- Why am I getting CAN errors on the OBD interface? I tested with 50k/83.3k/100k/125k/250k/500k, and I think that besides 250k (RX Errors), nothing useful came back.

Now, one could certainly program a controller or use software on the PC to 'decode' the KWP2000-over-CAN, but that seems very complex, and I don't know if the necessary data is available on the in-cabin CAN bus, and you would also have to figure out all the IDs.

By the way, diagnostics work with a Bosch Bluetooth diagnostic device (monster). However, you don't find out which protocol or physical interface is being used.

Please give me a starting point; I'm completely at a loss!'nI've been working on a project for some time now that deals with the collection and recording of driving data in the Mercedes Actros MP2. However, I'm a bit stuck and hope you can help me. Here's my current situation:Vehicles:- Mercedes Actros MP2 (first registration 2004)- Mercedes Actros MP2 (first registration 2005)Values to be recorded:- Speed, velocity, mileage, possibly gear and fuel consumption (calculate?).I connected the interface to the OBD connector of the 2005 Actros, and during the automatic search, CAN/29Bit/250kbaud was detected. Querying diagnostic codes (e.g., RPM 0C) returned usable values that I only needed to convert. For me, this means that the 2005 model uses a standard CAN format and supports diagnostics without additional protocols!

Another attempt with the 2004 model (yes, I thought they were identical }) unfortunately turned out completely differently. Diagnostic interface connected, no return values, or the ELM interface doesn't even identify the correct protocol. My attempts to manually set the protocol (bit rate, ID length, etc.) had no visible effect. Only with certain settings did I see broadcast messages, but they were marked as RX errors.

My second attempt involved using the K-line. The bus initialization was okay, and querying diagnostic codes also worked, but the return values were always the same and therefore unusable.

My third attempt, in desperation, was to tap into the in-cabin CAN bus, which is connected to the radio. After manually setting it to CAN/11bit/125kbaud, I received error-free broadcast messages. However, they were neither in ISO nor J1939 format. After researching on the internet, I found out that Mercedes uses 'KWP2000 over CAN' in the in-cabin bus. The ELM cannot handle this, and I could only display the raw data through monitoring.

Here is a 4-line DUMP; the first 4 bytes are the header, and the remaining 8 bytes are the message:
}

And that's when the confusion was complete, and I have the following questions:
- How can it be that two seemingly identical vehicles have such different diagnostic systems?
- How do I get the data from the 2004 model? And why does everything work smoothly in the 2005 model?
- I've read about a Mercedes COTEL interface that outputs data in J1939 format. Could it be that this is integrated into the 2005 model? Why would this interface then output data through the OBD interface?
- I don't understand why the K-line doesn't return any meaningful data. Any ideas?
- Why am I getting CAN errors on the OBD interface? I tested with 50k/83.3k/100k/125k/250k/500k, and I believe that besides 250k (RX Errors), nothing useful came back.

Now, one could certainly program a controller or use software on the PC to 'decode' the KWP2000-over-CAN, but it seems very complex, and I don't know if the necessary data is available in the in-cabin CAN bus, and you would also have to figure out all the IDs, as far as I understand.

By the way, diagnostics work with a Bosch Bluetooth diagnostic device (monster). However, you don't find out which protocol or physical interface is being used.

Please give me a starting point; I am completely at a loss!

THANK YOU VERY MUCH!
ChristiaI connected the interface to the OBD connector of the 2005 Actros, and during the automatic scan, it detected CAN/29Bit/250kbaud. When querying diagnostic codes (e.g., RPM 0C), I received usable values that only needed to be converted. For me, this means that the 2005 model uses a standard CAN format and supports diagnostics without additional protocols!Another attempt using a model from 2004 (yes, I thought they were the same }) unfortunately turned out completely different. The diagnostic interface was connected, but there were no return values, and the ELM interface couldn't even determine the correct protocol. My attempts to manually set the protocol (bit rate, ID length, etc.) yielded no visible results. Only with certain settings did I see broadcast messages, but they were marked as RX errors. My third attempt was driven by desperation to tap into the in-cabin CAN bus connected to the radio. After manually setting it to CAN/11bit/125kbaud, I received error-free broadcast messages. However, they were neither in ISO nor J1939 format. After researching online, I found that Mercedes uses 'KWP2000 over CAN' on the in-cabin bus. The ELM cannot handle this; I could only display the raw data through monitoring.

Here's a 4-line dump: the first 4 bytes are the header, and the remaining 8 bytes are the message:
}

And that's when the confusion became complete, and I have the following questions:
- How can it be that two seemingly identical vehicles have such different diagnostic systems?
- How do I get the data from the 2004 model? And why does everything work smoothly in the 2005 model?
- I've read about a Mercedes COTEL interface that outputs data in J1939 format. Could it be that this is integrated into the 2005 model? Why would this interface then output data through the OBD interface?
- I don't understand why the K-line doesn't return any meaningful data. Any ideas?
- Why am I getting CAN errors on the OBD interface? I tested with 50k/83.3k/100k/125k/250k/500k, and I believe that only at 250k (RX Errors) did anything usable come through.

Now, one could certainly program a controller or use software on a PC to 'decode' the KWP2000-over-CAN protocol, but it seems very complex, and I don't know if the necessary data is even present in the in-cabin CAN bus, and you would also have to figure out all the IDs, as far as I understand.

By the way, diagnostics work with a Bosch Bluetooth diagnostic device (monster). However, you don't find out which protocol or physical interface is being used.

Please give me a starting point; I am completely at a loss!

THANK YOU VERY MUCH!
ChristiMy third attempt was driven by desperation to tap into the in-car CAN bus connected to the radio. After manually setting it to CAN/11bit/125kbaud, I received error-free broadcast messages. However, they were neither in ISO nor J1939 format. Through online research, I discovered that Mercedes uses 'KWP2000 over CAN' on the in-car bus. The ELM device cannot handle this; I could only display the raw data through monitoring. Here's a 4-line dump; the first 4 bytes are the header, and the remaining 8 bytes constitute the message.And with that, the confusion was complete, and I found myself asking the following questions:- I read about a COTEL interface from Mercedes that outputs data in the J1939 format. Could it be integrated into the 2005 model? And if so, why would this interface also output data via the OBD interface?'Why am I getting so many CAN errors on the OBD interface? I've tested with baud rates of 50k, 83.3k, 100k, 125k, 250k, and 500k, but it seems like nothing useful comes through except maybe at 250k (with RX errors).

It would certainly be possible to program a controller or use software on a PC to 'decode' the KWP2000 over CAN, but that seems very complicated. Also, I'm not sure if the necessary data is present on the CAN bus inside the vehicle, and I would also need to figure out all those IDs, as far as I understand it.

By the way, diagnostics work with a Bosch Bluetooth diagnostic device (a real monster). However, you don't find out which protocol or physical interface is being used.

Please give me some guidance; I'm completely at a loss!''Now, you could certainly program a controller or use software on a PC to 'decode' the KWP2000-over-CAN communication, but it seems very complex. I also don't know if the necessary data is present on the CAN bus inside the vehicle, and you would also need to figure out all the IDs, as far as I understand.'

'By the way, diagnostics work with a Bosch Bluetooth diagnostic tool (a real monster!). However, you don't find out which protocol or physical interface is being used.'

'Please give me some guidance; I am completely at a loss!'

'THANK YOU VERY MUCH!'
Christia'Besides that, the diagnosis works with a Bosch Bluetooth diagnostic tool. However, it doesn't reveal which protocol or physical interface is being used.

Please give me some guidance; I'm completely at a loss!

THANK YOU VERY MUCH!
Chri'Furthermore, the diagnosis works with a Bosch Bluetooth diagnostic device. However, it doesn't reveal which protocol or physical interface is being used.THANK YOU VERY MUCH!
ChristiaChristian.

Hi,

du hast schon gute arbeit geleistet und dir alles mögliche getan. warum die protokolle so unterschiedlich sein sollen, verstehe ich auch nicht.
If nothing else works: How does the Body Control Module (BCM) send data to the Instrument Panel Cluster (IPC)? If that's also a bus, then I would tap into it there.

You can also get wheel speed information via a regular cable. Similarly, the current gear should be available as a wire signal. If necessary, you may have to gather all these signals and connect them using a controller.

I'm sorry, but I need more context to provide an accurate translation. Please provide the text you would like me to translate from German to English.aoYou can also get the wheel speed via a standard cable. The current gear should also be available as a signal. If necessary, you may have to gather all these signals and connect them using a controller.

Best regards,
ciahello

Hi joeausro,

danke für deine Antwort.
I actually wanted to avoid tinkering too much, because unfortunately I'm a computer scientist and not an automotive engineer . I have now ordered another OBD2 adapter with an ELM chip, and I might also get the CANUSB interface. Somehow, I suspect that the RX errors are occurring for some compatibility reason, because in principle, at least reasonable data should be received.

I've read a bit about the Mercedes COTEL interface and found out that it should be built-in by default and only needs to be activated. It might have something to do with that.
see: http://old.nabble.com/Mercedes-source-address-td24160999.html

Shouldn't the K-line at least function properly?

How does the Body Control Module (BCM) get the data to the Instrument Panel Cluster (IPC)?
--> I have no idea, but it can certainly be found out. However, I wanted to avoid tinkering too much with the vehicle's internal buses, regarding warranty and insurance.

Could anything really happen if I just listen to the bus? Electrically, there shouldn't be any damage, as the CAN should be relatively stable.

Does anyone know how willing automotive manufacturers are to provide technical support? Our 'expert' workshops in the region were not very enthusiastic about my questions, ranging from 'no idea,' 'Which model is the bus?' to 'I don't know the CAN bus,' and even 'highly illegal' and 'could explode.'

What a mess ;)

Best regards, ChristianI actually wanted to avoid having to tinker around too much, because unfortunately I'm a computer scientist and not an automotive engineer }. I've now ordered another OBD2 adapter with an ELM chip, and I might also get the CANUSB interface. Somehow, I suspect that the RX errors are occurring for some compatibility reason, because otherwise, at least reasonably good data should be coming through.I've been reading a bit more about the Mercedes COTEL interface and found out that it should be built-in by default and only needs to be activated. It might have something to do with that.see: }http://old.nabble.com/Mercedes-source-address-td24160999.html}How does the Body Control Module (BCM) get data to the Instrument Panel Cluster (IPC)?
--> I have no idea, but it can probably be figured out. However, I wanted to avoid messing around too much with the vehicle's internal buses due to warranty and insurance concerns.

Could something bad happen if I just listen in on the bus? Electrically, there shouldn't be any damage, as the CAN bus should be relatively stable.

Does anyone know how willing car manufacturers are to provide technical support? Our 'expert' workshops in the region were not very enthusiastic about my questions; they ranged from 'I have no idea,' 'Which model is the bus?' and 'I don't know the CAN bus' to 'highly illegal' and 'could explode.'

What a mess }.

Best regards, ChristiaCan anything great happen if I just listen to the bus? Electrically, there shouldn't be any damage, as the CAN bus should be relatively stable.

Does anyone know how willing car manufacturers are to provide technical support? Our 'expert' workshops in the region weren't very enthusiastic about my questions; they ranged from 'I have no idea,' 'What model is the bus?' and 'I don't know the CAN bus' to 'highly illegal' and 'could explode.'

What a mess }.

Best regards, Christ.'Could anything bad happen if I just listen in on the bus's communication system? Electrically, it probably wouldn't cause any damage, as the CAN bus should be relatively stable.'It's a complete mess }.

Best regards, Chris.What a mess }. Best regards, Christian.

ich denk mal, dass die eine version schon odb2 kompatibel ist (und sich deshalb mit dem elm 32x auslesen laesst).

apropo: welchen elm hast du denn? unter nem elm327 geht naemlich garnix.

dreh den spiess mal um: fahr mit dem ding mal zu ner freien werkstaette und lass den fehlerspeicher auslesen (obd2 funktion). wenn der tester das kann weisst du das der fehler woanders liegt.

den canusb adapter würd ich erstmal beiseite stellen, da du -wenn du can botschaften empfaengst - diese erst decodieren und den entsprechenden funktionen zuordnen musst.
For example: 0x108 07 02 00 00 00 00 00 00. This would be a CAN message. In the case of Chevrolet, it comes from the ECM and indicates the current engine speed.

The addresses vary from manufacturer to manufacturer, and even within vehicle generations. Therefore, in this case, absolute detective work would be necessary.

What you're planning to do likely already exists commercially.?'Whatever you're planning to do, there's probably already a commercial version of it.''Whatever you're planning to do, it probably already exists commercially, right?'

Hi joeausro,

ich hab einen ELM327. Mich wundert nur, dass ein Fahrzeug welches BJ 2004 ist, nicht OBD2 kompatibel sein soll. Kann ich mir nicht wirkl. vorstellen. Vorallem wundern mich die RX Errors. Ich werds nochmal mit einem anderen CAN-OBD Adapter probieren. Da wir hier, sozusagen, eine Freie Werkstatt sind (Fahrschule für Berufskraftfahrer), haben wir auch ein Diag-Gerät von Bosch. Damit funktioniert auch das auslesen, nur habe ich keine Ahnung wie das Gerät die Daten abfragt. AuYou won't find any information about it in the programs.
Ich warte noch auf eine aktuelle Lieferung eines ELMScan5, vieleicht funktioniert das besser als dieses Billig-Produkt welches ich hier habe!

Since Mercedes apparently uses its own CAN protocol, is there any documentation available for this protocol? Or is it a 'secret,' as is often the case? I have 10 Actros trucks here, and reverse engineering might even be worthwhile. However, it would be much easier if there were a protocol description available!

I would have to rule out a commercial solution because I need to use the data in my own software; therefore, the commercial solution would have to be open-source at a minimum. The only thing that would be useful is an FMS module that converts data from CAN-Mercedes to J1939, and it seems that the COTEL module from Mercedes does exactly that. I'll check right away to see if it's installed; perhaps it just needs to be activated. werden.

THANK YOU for your help; I'm going to start crafting again .

Christian.

Okay, I'd like to chime in again on this topic.

Unfortunately, the OBD data retrieval process didn't work, and I also couldn't achieve success with a different ELM adapter. Therefore, I decided to reverse engineer the CAN bus data. So far, everything has been working quite smoothly. I used a CAN sniffer to read data for an hour and saved it as a CSV file. Then, I imported those 1.4 million data entries into a MySQL database and wrote a Java program for graphically analyzing the PIDs.

This tool is quite useful for analyzing the 'data traffic' in a vehicle. The only thing missing is the engine speed, and the data still needs to be 'adjusted.'

I'm wondering why I can't retrieve the mileage as a value. Does anyone have any information on how and where it might be stored?

I would make the Java application available to interested parties in source code format; perhaps some experts could improve it.
I will also provide the Actros PID table including descriptions, etc. Does anyone know if something like this could cause problems with a Mercedes vehicle?

Best regards, Christian.

tolle arbeit!
sind die daten der verschiedenen actros jetzt gleich?

was machen denn die vielen fensterchen?
hello

I haven't tested the newer models yet, as I currently only have the 2004 model in the workshop. However, I will do so and then potentially publish my findings (if permitted).

Each window displays a CAN ID with a bar graph for each byte. This allows you to play back the driving data at any speed and precisely analyze what happened where and when.
It's essentially a CAN bus recorder.

I'm going to rewrite this thing a bit for live display using the CANUSB interface and for replaying it on the physical CAN bus in the test setup. This way, I can simulate my own vehicle from my office, or something similar .

I'm now looking for a suitable component that I can build onto an existing circuit board for my circuits.
I can (within an embedded system), and I recently read about various alternative CAN-USB interfaces. As I mentioned, it's purely for monitoring the bus.

Best regards, Christian.

das interface würde ich selbermachen. hast du erfahrung mit mikrocontrollern bzw programmierung? erfahrung schaltungsentwurf/prototypenbau?
I'd be happy to help you with that -> PMI'd be happy to help you with that -> DM (Direct Message).

Yes, there is a wealth of electronics knowledge , and you have a project manager.

Hello Christian,

I'm also playing around with things for my thesis project, though.
I have a Mercedes-Benz E-Class from the year 2006.
The communication is actually going quite well, but the data I'm receiving is different from what I expect.

For example, the engine speed is specified in the ELM327 documentation as: Engine Speed = Read Value / 4.

If I do it this way, I get a value of approximately 8 at a speed of 2000 RPM, and the values are also incorrect for the other speeds.

Do you have any information about that?

Regards,
Peter.

Hello Peter,

ja, das hatte ich auch schon festgestellt. Allerdings habe ich es dann nicht weiter mit dem ELM, aufgrund der genannten Probleme mit dem 2004er Modell, versucht. Ich habe das Ganze jetzt wesentlich aufwändiger und flexibler gestalltet, ich habe mich direkt an den Innenraum BUS gehangen. Im Actros herrscht z.B. am Radio ein CAN Bus mit 29Bit und 125kbaud. Gemessen und protokolliert habe ich über das CANUSB Interface von Lawicel. für die Auswertung habe ich meine eigene Software geschrieben. EI've calculated some missing information, but it seems to vary slightly in each vehicle.

If you need any information, feel free to contact me.

Hi !
war eigentlich auf der Suche nach Can-Codes für VW\Audi und bin über das Actros-Problem gestolpert.
D'Connecting to the CAN bus is actually not a problem - have you solved this yet, or should I provide more information?

1. Connecting anywhere on the CAN bus is forbidden; the manufacturer (Mercedes) must provide an interface that does not affect the vehicle's operation. This is the FMS interface, and it provides all relevant data. I can provide plans and documentation for this.
2. I have detailed documentation for all FMS data.

This should be sufficient and is legal.

Connecting to the engine CAN bus is extremely dangerous, and in a worst-case scenario, your insurance coverage will be void - which is great, considering the potential damage amounts in a serious truck accident.
Only the manufacturer or Sqarrel from the Netherlands are legally allowed to do this; they have obtained e-certification and are permitted to connect to the engine CAN bus because they ensure that nothing is written to it.
Actros models from 2004 onwards already have FMS on board.

If anyone wants to know how it works with Actros or MAN trucks, please contact me.
Best regards,
Robe'rt1. It is forbidden to connect to the CAN bus in any location that could interfere with the vehicle's operation. The manufacturer (Mercedes) must provide an interface where this is not possible. This is the FMS interface, and it provides all relevant data. I can provide plans and documentation for this.
2. I have detailed documentation for all FMS data.

This should be sufficient and is legal.
Connecting to the engine CAN bus is extremely dangerous and could void insurance coverage – which is a terrible thought, considering the potential damage amounts in a serious truck accident.
Only the manufacturer or Sqarrel from the Netherlands are legally allowed to do this. They have obtained e-certification and are permitted to connect to the engine CAN bus because they ensure that no unauthorized data is written there.
Actros models from 2004 onwards already have FMS built in.
If anyone wants to know how it works with Actros or MAN trucks, please contact me.
Best regards,
Robert.'It is forbidden to attach anything to the CAN bus; instead, the manufacturer (Mercedes) must provide an interface for this purpose.''...in a way that the vehicle is not affected. This is the FMS interface, and it provides all the relevant data.''I have detailed documentation for all FMS data.

This should be sufficient and is legal.
Connecting to the engine CAN bus is extremely dangerous and, in a worst-case scenario, could void your insurance coverage - which is really great, considering the potential damage amounts in a serious truck accident.
Only the manufacturer or Sqarrel from the Netherlands are legally allowed to do this; they have obtained e-certification and are permitted to access the engine CAN bus because they ensure that nothing unauthorized is written there.
Actros trucks manufactured after 2004 already have FMS on board.
If anyone wants to know how it works with Actros or MAN trucks, please contact me.
Best regards,
Ro''For all FMS data, I have detailed documentation.'Connecting to the engine control unit (ECU) is extremely dangerous and, in the event of a major accident ('super-GAU'), your insurance coverage may be void - that's really cool, especially considering the potential damage amounts in a serious truck crash.
Legally, only the manufacturer or Sqarrel from the Netherlands are allowed to do this. They have obtained e-certification and are permitted to connect to the ECU because they ensure that nothing unauthorized is written into it.
Actros trucks produced after 2004 don't need this, as they already have FMS (Fleet Management System) on board.
If anyone wants to know how it works with Actros or MAN trucks, feel free to ask.
Best regards,
RobeAttaching oneself to a train engine is extremely dangerous, and in the event of a 'worst-case scenario,' insurance coverage will be void – that's totally awesome.Only the manufacturer or Sqarrel from the Netherlands are legally allowed to do this. They have obtained the e-certification and are authorized to modify the MotorCan because...If anyone wants to know how it works with Actros or MAN trucks, feel free to ask.Best regards,

Hello, can anyone tell me where I can find the FMS interface in an Actros/Atego truck?

Found it...

Actros 1: Not all PSM control units are compatible with FMS.
If so, the FMS connection to the PSM is located on connector X1, pins 18/16 (CAN Low) and 18/18 (CAN High).

For base module versions 2 and 3, the connections on the base module are as follows: pin X5 6/5 is CAN Low, and pin X5 6/2 is CAN High. The power supply for the FMS interface can be taken from connector X7 on the base module. After that, if not already done, the Cotel interface on the base module should be parameterized.

Actros MP3: The FMS CAN bus (CAN H and CAN L) provides the FMS signal, which becomes available after activation in the COTEL interface, on the X5 connector located in the fuse box.